Ian Lavery – MP for Blyth and Ashington (#26)

Episode 26 of the Money Made Human podcast features Ian Lavery, MP for Blyth and Ashington.

Ian has dedicated much of his career to public service, representing communities through both the trade union movement and Parliament. In this episode, host Gayle Lloyd speaks with Ian about the experiences that have shaped his values, his journey into politics, and the realities of serving as an elected representative. The conversation also explores the lasting impact of the miners' strikes, the importance of trade unions and credit unions in supporting communities, and Ian's hopes for the future.

Key topics in this episode include:

• How Ian's upbringing, family, and experiences of poverty shaped his values
• The impact of the miners' strikes on his family and wider society
• His role as President of the National Union of Mineworkers
• Why trade unions and credit unions remain important to local communities
• His journey into politics and role as an MP
• The realities of serving as an elected representative

We hope you enjoy listening!

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:00

Welcome to the Money Made Human Podcast. It celebrates at its heart the work of credit unions and their vital role in enriching our lives and communities. Brought to you by First Class Credit Union, each episode features insightful discussions revealing the meaningful impact that can be made through economic collaboration. Mostly, it's a collection of compassionate conversations about navigating life and the individual journeys we take. We are delighted today to be joined by Ian Leavery, MP for Blythe and Ashington. Ian, I have to say, first of all, I love your accent. I think the Scottish have a special affinity for those from the northeast of the country. So I love that, first of all. Well, can I tell you, Gail?

SPEAKER_00 1:02

I mean, this my accent is quite distinct from most even Northeast accent. It's a pit dialect. It's from the pits. It's from, you know, in where I live and lived on my life in Ashington was the biggest coal mining area in Europe, biggest coal mining town in Europe. People had different accents in different pit villages, you know, like less than like a mile apart, sort of thing. It's a Northumbrian, like brought type accent rather than a Newcastle Tyneside accent. Um and it's it's renowned across the world, really. People when I've been, you know, when I've been on Holland, people say, Oh, you're Norwegian, nice to meet you. You know, no, I'm not Norwegian. I'm like, and you know, if you see them from Washington, either say uh or the Charlton brothers, that's where they live. Or you you've got to like basically say you're from Newcastle. You know, it's it's fairly, fairly distinct.

SPEAKER_03 2:11

It's it's so nice and friendly and kind sounding, so I know we love it. Um, Ian, I've got so many questions for you, really, about um how the trade union and credit union movements are important for society. Um, would love to talk to you a bit about politics. It's been a busy week in Westminster. And also I'd like to go back to the past and find out a bit more about you. And obviously, you mentioned mining, and that was that's been a big part of your life as well. Um, I I have a grandfather that was a a miner, so I I appreciate all the work that you've done for the National Union of Mine Workers. But let me come back to that. What was it like growing up, Ian? What did it look like for you growing up, and how did that childhood inform your values?

SPEAKER_00 3:05

Well, it depends like what you mean by what age uh growing up. When I was a young lad, a boy, little boy, yeah. Uh we lived in um an upstairs flat, two-bedroom upstairs flat, with my mom, my dad, and three of my brothers, because the other one, the the youngest one wasn't born there. So you can imagine what sort of uh conditions there were. Um and we we grew up in poverty. But and I look back, you didn't realize you know that you're living in poverty for years and years and years ahead, and you look back, and I'll look back at my time very fondly. My mom didn't work um officially, my mom did leaflets and she did what she could because she had to look after the family. And my dad, um my dad worked at the pit. Um, so we we grew up uh in in great poverty, uh, to put to be honest with you. There was like three was in one double bed, one in the single bed, and then uh the my mom and dad run the other room. Well, we lived we lived in a then we moved on to um probably what would be classed as one of the most deprived states in the northeast, if not the country. And uh we lived there, me younger brother was born, so there was five, it was five lads, my mom and my dad. And the one thing is, Gail, honestly, is that poverty is awful, really is. But when everybody is around you is in poverty, um you don't really realize it. Sure. Um, if everybody's got note, they've gotten out. Uh, but obviously, you know, you look at uh at other places when when you're you're growing up, you look at other people at school, and the that was a uh uh realization that other people had uh had money, you know. But uh one thing my mom and my dad were absolutely wonderful people, very loving people, loved with a protected, with a look after we had to have a bath every single day. My mom used to stick our head under the top and very roughly make sure that we were clean. So every day, every night, we went to bed all very clean uh and smart for school the next day. Um, I had a we had a loving um loving family, and it it's it's really fun. We we look my older brother died two years ago. Me and my other brothers uh we look back at it very firmly, you know. We'll have some great laughs.

SPEAKER_03 5:56

Was that your first experience in thinking about money and financials, or did that come later when you reflect back on it? And you said you know you didn't have anything? Would that just come later, that reflection rather than at the time?

SPEAKER_00 6:14

It came much later. Yeah, but it's gonna come come much, much later. I think it's when you get into your teens, um, when you want the the new trainers, um, or you want the new football boots, or you want the the latest football strip. Um, because that's the only thing that you're really bothered about when you just come into your teens, you want to be you know one of the lads or one of the last, you know, you want to be up there with the A team sort of thing. Uh, you begin to realize then that despite the fact that your mom and dad are doing the very, very best. Um they can buy five lads a pair of night trainers. Sure. Um, and it wasn't night at the time, night probably hadn't been heard of at the time. But anyway, your mum, your mom and dad could afford to buy everybody the best. Of course. And we, you know, as a family, we we used to get uh handy downs, you know, because we're like me my oldest brother, then would pass his clothes onto the uh the next one, and used to get you know all the way down the tree until there was no left. Um, and it's not until you realize that because when you're a young and young, you don't even realize that you're wearing the cheapest clothes, you didn't realize that other people have spent like a fortune on uh their their type of denim jeans. Um so it it's like when you get into your teens, and it's it's when you're like beginning to make your way in the world, you're looking around and seeing what other people have got and wondering, I wonder how they manage that. And uh very low intensity at that age, but when you get older and older and older, you know, when you you're looking for your your first girlfriend or you know want to be one of the lads, um you start to like want things that you see other people have got and yeah, realization that you really cannot because of the fact that your mom and dad's got five uh laddies. Um it it are you know it's very, very difficult.

SPEAKER_03 8:18

I I don't know if you you also had a reflection that I don't know if your parents are still around at all.

SPEAKER_00 8:26

No, they've worked out the work there now.

SPEAKER_03 8:30

In terms of you do look back, don't you, and think, my goodness, those parents did a really good job with what they had as well.

SPEAKER_00 8:40

Honestly, I mean my mother died when she was only 53. Um and and uh again, me and my brothers don't talk about this. We honestly believe it's the like the stress. The fact that my mother wanted everything she possibly could for us. She put food on the table, she went to work uh during the day and at night time. As I said before, probably not in the the um the industries where you um were like legal, uh the word illegal, but she she was deliberately flitted, she was doing anything she could to make that extra few quid, not for herself, by the way, but for the lads. For you for the lads. Again, when when you look back, my mother was a really fantastic person. She was a she used to write poetry, she played the piano. Um you know, like lots of people of my age at that time, their parents couldn't do anything like that, you know. But I that they honestly believe that as a consequence of having to look after five lads and my father. Um nobody used to help her make sure there was food on the table, nobody used to help her to make sure that the electricity bills or the rent was paid, you know. And probably my father was lacking in that sort of thing as well, you know. Um and I just think that she had a she must have had a terribly stressful life, loved us to bits, but I honestly believe that it at least contributed to the fact that you died, you know. This is a consequence of poverty.

SPEAKER_03 10:26

Yeah, I was gonna ask, were your family impacted by the minor strikes in the early 80s?

SPEAKER_00 10:32

Massively.

unknown 10:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:35

Again, um, the L again, that was that was something which we we often reflect on because during the minor strike, that time there was myself, dad, two me brothers on strike. We used to kind of take it in in the morning. We used to we used to get in all sorts, well, our date in particular, getting all sorts of trouble. Uh, we used to come back later, you know, like early or whatever time, and expect that it'd be a meal on the table, expect that the electricity had been paid, the rent had been paid, and it was all down to me, ma'am, because we didn't get any strike pay during a minor strike. Uh, we're fighting for the jobs of you know our children for the future, the communities of the future. Didn't get any strike peers, so it was really, really difficult. Wasn't any money coming in for more than a year, you know. Um, and uh, I think that again that was a huge contribution to why my mom died so young.

SPEAKER_03 11:40

Was that an influence to you in terms of what you went on to do?

SPEAKER_00 11:46

Um, my mom was um, I mean, she she her rule, you know, whether we like it or dislike it, her rule was long enough to us. Totally committed to our to our bands, to our wins. Um my father who worked at the pit, uh, he was a you know a big, strong, powerful man, uh good worker, good grafter. Uh, he had a lot of respect in the little community. He had a lot of respect in the mining industry in the pit at the time. He was a big Labour man. When I say a big Labour man, he you know, he would never like he probably wouldn't have gotten any Labour meetings, but he was solid Labour and um a solid, solid trade unionist, solid member of the NUM. And if there was any difficulties at meetings, you know, he might be there and would listen to what he had to say. So I always listen to what my father had to say with regard to you know, when when I become a working age, um, you know, you start to listen to what you know your father was saying, and to be honest, he was never far from the m.

SPEAKER_03 13:01

Was he an inspiration to you in terms of your future career?

SPEAKER_00 13:06

You know what? The biggest, one of the biggest and best pieces of advice I've ever had in my life was from me me dad. And that was when the minor strike first started very early days, like the first year, I was an indentured apprentice, and the national union of my workers said categorically, it was a decision made at national level that apprentices should go to work. And I sat, we sat at the table, my mother, my father, my brothers, and I says, Look, I've been told by the union it's okay, and gonna work, you're an indentured apprentice. So the union was got no objection. And I said to me, Well, you know, should I be doing that? Should I be bringing some money in for the family? And he says, Definitely, definitely not. He says, You never, ever, ever cross a picking. He says, I'm gonna tell you somebody, and he says, if you might whether the union agreed to win or not, if you went to work during the strike for the rest of your life, you'll be telling people that you went to work. But the union said it was okay. He says, if you've got to try and explain yourself, um uh you've got to be you've got to understand that it's not the right thing, she says, do what you want, and she says, but my advice is definitely do not cross the picket line under any circumstances. And I says, That's good enough for me. Um, so I didn't get to work, obviously, and then uh the strike took place. And uh again, we'll look back at it, we've got some fantastic memories of the the time during the miner strike we had um at school.

SPEAKER_04 14:49

Fantastic memories.

SPEAKER_03 14:51

It was a difficult time for the country because it wasn't just the miners that were out on strike, it forced a striking in other industries like British steel, the steel workers were in on strike as well because they didn't have the coal for the furnaces and so on. It was a really difficult time for the whole country at that point.

SPEAKER_00 15:13

It was a difficult time. There weren't many people, um, to be honest, uh, we didn't get like we got great verbal support.

SPEAKER_01 15:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:22

And we got plenty of the the union, uh, got plenty of financial support. Uh however, the the support on the ground was very thin. Um, you know, that there was like the train drivers, um the train operators, uh, the railway workers, a lot of the people in the Transport and General Workers Union. That was lots of solidarity action, but it wasn't on a massive scale. So we were basically on strike on our own, apart from that great support. You know, we have great support from uh international voters, we had great support from national and from regional, um, and the solidarity expressed. Should I tell you just some of which are really again, I'll not forget the South African miners who were very lowly paid uh and very much abused in the workplace? They sent a check to the National Union of Mine Workers, but the miners themselves who basically were living in ten huts, you know, they had club together and they sent a check to the National Union of Mineworkers, and the money, uh, the worth of the check wasn't that great at all. But the solidarity and the thoughts of these people who live in the most abjective conditions, who work in a desperate environment, who were being abused by the employer, thought they would club together and give the give the British miners what they could nothing that had less than nothing. It was just absolutely iconic, and that check. Check was framed and it was on the the wall in the National Union of Mine Workers for a long time. And I and I like I'll never forget that. And I've been to South Africa a few times and I met the miners, and um it was just a great act of solidarity in it at the Christmas time during the strike. You know, there was juggernauts of the juggernautes of um toys from the CGT in France. They made a pledge, you know, that not one miner's child would go without a present at Christmas. So they had these Barbie dolls and footballs, and the the basically pulled the juggernauts up in different towns and villages, right? And you had a queue, and we had to try and get the footballs because we'll the boys, sort of thing. Um, uh, and the lasses wanted the Barbie dolls, but quite often one would run out, so you'd see a lot of the little lads in the community walking over with the Barbie dolls, wishing that I'd been in the queue in front to get a football. But it was again a great memory. Um, the minor strike. The best Christmas, one of the best Christmases in my lifetime, because you know what we did, and I was just a young lad then, it was only 2021. We made sure that all the kids had a fantastic time. Uh and they probably had more during the minor strike Christmas than the had before, not in terms of presence, in terms of love and affection and care. Uh, it was just it was it was great, man.

SPEAKER_03 18:43

I love that. And and you went on in to work for the National Union of Mine Workers. How did how did that progress?

SPEAKER_00 18:54

Well, it progressed from the minor strike because I was um very active during the minor strike. Uh I got arrested a number of times uh during the minor strike. Uh and I got locked up a lot of times during the minor strike. Um uh I wasn't an angel before the strike, and I certainly wasn't an angel during it. To be honest, I'm not an angel new, but I've never been never been in trouble with the police either before or after the strike. The only time I've ever been in trouble with the police is during the minor strike, and I make no apologies for that. But after the minor strike, um basically the it started in the social club after an Anyway local meeting. Uh the couple of the local officials were there and says, Ian, the we would love you to put your name for to be on the committee. I said, Oh, I'm not sure what that, but I did. And I got elected on because you get elected in where where I work it was uh two and a half thousand people with the pig. Uh, and then I got um elected to be the compensation secretary. Compensation secretary used to look after people who had injuries, look after families who maybe have lost the load one. The the compensation secretary was a person who would speak to the families, speak to the lawyers, get the information, pull things together, and try and get the maximum compensation for anybody. And and that that was my I loved I loved that rule. It was it was very, very uh you know, very, very difficult and dark at times. Um but uh that that was that was one of the first things, and then I became a regional and Northumbled official. Uh again, elected all my positions because I've been elected in every one. So uh, you know, you've got to have that track record in minus different vote for people uh who haven't got the utmost respect for. Then uh I became uh uh was elected onto the National Executive Committee of the NUM. And uh I mean that was just unreal. My first meeting, I went into Sheffield, right? My name card there, Lavery, and it was next to Dennis Skinner. Well, you know, Dennis Skinner had been a hero in my from the strike, uh a labor and trade union hero. Uh and here's me, Lavery, from like the roughest place in Assembly, one of the roughest places in the you know in England. Well, and I'm sitting next to Dennis Skinner.

SPEAKER_04 21:36

Um, it was what did your dad think about that? He was he was just absolutely thought it was brilliant.

SPEAKER_00 21:43

He used to give us plenty of advice. Um and he pol he used to policy, to be honest. I was still like young at the time, I had like a sleeker earring in. Um and um You know, like refused to wear a suit. Okay. Um, and my father was, you know, my father was an old miner. Uh, when I used to go in the club, he had a uh shirt on his hair was immaculate. And and he in his shit, but he says, You're gonna have to put your ideas up. You need to like smarten yourself. You know, might be thinking about yourself, but what about other people? You're all representing other people, you've got to get your act again, and you've got to dress right, dress properly. Then I was I did a television first, probably one of the first television interviews ever did. I was so proud of myself. And my uncle who worked at the pit said, you know, you had two in groom in your mouth when you're doing that interview. He says, Never ever do that again. I'm telling you, and he really, really got stuck into you. I mean, that when you think about it, no, it's it that's they're the people who shape your life. Sure. The core of your character.

SPEAKER_03 23:03

Can I ask you a question about the minor strike, which has just occurred to me? A dear friend of first class credit union is Hugh Gaffney, who was a former MP, but he's just written a book about a local mining disaster, Ockingek, um, which happened a few miles away from here. What's the basis of the strike for more pay? Was that linked to the dangers of the job?

SPEAKER_00 23:33

Well, can I just say though, Gail? I'm not Hugh Gaffney very well. Uh and greatly had a posty. She was a posting. Yes, of course. Um he sent us a copy of his book, a signed copy of his book. Yes. Uh I haven't read it yet, but what's more important than that? I've actually spoke at the Auckland Geek Memorial on two occasions. Sure. Uh Geek um Miners Welfare. That's the big like the Memorial Garden. Uh I've I've been there on more than one occasion. Um, so that that that's uh another thing. So Hugh sent us a copy of his book. Nice. Um that just texts him. The minor strike, the minor strike was about it wasn't pit closures because of the the mines, the pits, these were the the the centre of the economy, not the centre of the economy, the worthy economy. Like hundreds of pit villages up and down to Scotland. Wales, England, uh, Scotland. Um, and and and the pits were the things that's why the villages were there because of the pits, because of the pool. Uh, and that's why there was like local shops, and that's why there was uh leisure centres or libraries. Shouldn't forget, you know, it was a miners and sales. And many, many years ago, when the pits were like opening, the miners who weren't on great wages, they appeared money from the backside pocket for the libraries in the towns, for the leisures, for the swimming pools. Um, but all of these, and they've got a rich, rich traditions and cultures which come across the border, whipped racing, pigeon racing, leak growing, flower grown, onion, onions grown, and all of us in the groups. What a brilliant and fantastic culture that the miners right across the UK actually had. We uh the union wanted to prevent enclosures because of an ideology of the Conservative government. We wanted to make sure it wasn't about wages, terms, and conditions. Okay. 1984, 85 dispute was solely about enclosures. Previous disputes, Gil, previous dispute disputes had been about uh low wages, reduction of wages, different types of um uh proposals on wages, but the the big strike was purely about saving the communities which we live.

SPEAKER_03 26:21

And I guess on that point about community, it's why trade unions and credit unions are really important because of the onward impact we can make to a community as well. What what would your views, Ian, on on the importance of credit unions alongside trade unions for communities?

SPEAKER_00 26:43

The credit unions play an ever increasingly huge role uh in areas like where I live and the the former mining communities, you know. A lot of places where there's a lot of deprivation, a lot of places where uh people just need like a little bit of a boost. In a financial position where there might be like just keeping the head above water, but anything extra they cannot manage. Um and the couldn't get a loan, plenty of loans off the local loan shocks, the local gangsters, a local mafia, plenty of aim at um at despicable rates. And unfortunately, there's a lot of people driven towards it. You know, the fact that the credit unions uh uh and in different areas means uh people who couldn't and possibly wouldn't get any financial assistance from elsewhere uh have the opportunity. So the the the the idea, you know, and the thing of behind the trade you the uh credit unions is first class.

SPEAKER_03 27:54

No, we we totally agree, and we don't want anyone to go to loan sharks. It's it's such a dangerous pathway. And for you, Ian, you moved from the National Union of Mine Workers into politics and became an MP. How long have you been a serving MP for now?

SPEAKER_00 28:13

Well, the you know, the move, I was I was a politician. I was a president of the National Union of Mine Workers, which was the top job. I I took over the a job from Arthur Scorgill when Arthur um retired in 2000.

SPEAKER_03 28:32

What was he? What was he like in person?

SPEAKER_00 28:36

Very difficult. Was he uh very difficult, but probably the the the the best negotiator uh I've ever ever seen of a Nansen, a very, very intelligent man, no compromise whatsoever, um, but a very very very intelligent man, and he had a great vision for the future. Um well I think he he I like to think that I learned a lot of things from Arthur. But I would like to think that a lot of the things that uh I could have learned, I shoved the side, um you know tremendous, tremendous individual. Tremendous individually. So I uh when I retired, I became the uh the the uh the the the um president of the union and then in 2010 the MPs joke came up in in umsbeck and that covered the the area where I lived. I was never like looking to be an MP. I didn't have my heart. You know what? If you have a look at the MPs in the I'm in the comments now. If you have a look at the MPs in here now, the vast majority wanted to be an MP since we were three. I wanted to be an ice cream man when I was three. That's that's what my vocation in life was. That was my ambition to be my vocation in life to sell these 99s with Luffy Flatties. Um look where I am now. And people might say you should have been an ice cream man, he never mind whatever that's and how how long have you been in the commons for? Um uh I was elected in the 2010 election, so I've been in there 16 years. Well 16 years now.

SPEAKER_03 30:24

Does the role that your your mum and dad and and how they influenced you, does that stay with you in the commons? You know, do you feel their values and do you use them day to day?

SPEAKER_00 30:38

You can you you could ask most people, most fair-minded people in in the commons who really leveraged. And I would hope they would say, Um, I mean, I am a bit of a beast, I've got to admit it, politically. I but in terms of socially, uh I would expect um if people are fair, they would say very courteous, a gentleman. Um I'm always you know very, you know, very respectful of other people, regardless of what side of the uh unless you get into the embroiled into the um the political debate, that's different. But generally, socially, um I would hope that I've got all the traits of my father and all the loving parts of my mother. Or either have they've guided me. That I mean, obviously, I'm part of them. Uh and and I was very proud of him because my father was always a really nice bloke. New Man Mountain, anybody crossed them, and then it was like, you know, that was that was that was hell to pay. Just a just a lovely bloke, and I think I'd uh thought people would say that about us, and I would want people to say that about us.

SPEAKER_03 31:57

Ian, at the time of recording this, it's been a really busy week in Westminster, and we saw the Prime Minister, uh Keir Starmer resign yesterday. And and I guess I wanted to ask you a couple of different questions that you might not expect, but on a human level, it can seem quite brutal from the outside. And and I guess the second question I wanted to ask is can any prime minister resolve the issues in the country? It it almost feels like the mentality of football managers that do they get enough time to govern before the next one comes in? Because we've had quite a lot of prime ministers over the last few years. What what's your take on it all? And is it is it difficult on a human level?

SPEAKER_00 32:50

Yes, two very, very important questions. Politics is a brutal business, it's absolutely no doubt about that.

SPEAKER_01 32:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:58

Look at it at Keir Stoma and anarchist. I was on the shadow cabinet with Kia for four years, the chair of the Labour Party when Kia was the shadow minister for Brexit. Um, so anarchia stormer, and he he he he he was a decent sort of blood, yeah, um, not a politician. And and when Keir was elected, he was brutal. We had 650,000 members when I was chair, nearly 650,000 members. Now we've got like under Kia's stewardship under 200,000. Okay. So you can see uh, and we've had lots of people um who have worked for the Labour Party, uh, lots of counselors, lots of activists who were brutally kicked through the Labour Party, expelled by a coup from uh Stormer's Labour Together project. Um, I've I've seen lots of people in tears have given their life to the Labour Party and were kicked through for very, very, very minor uh incidents. In my uh the case in my constituency, somebody who wrote an article for Milan in 1975 was expelled from the Labour Party after all that year's membership. Somebody else who had a cake uh with Sir Sus DePelon, which is a publication, names on a photograph, taking the party, being a member, and that gives so you know it is brutal, it really is brutal, but uh you've got a if you're you know ditching that sort of brutality out, shouldn't really cry when it clicks uh back and kicks it the boom, really.

SPEAKER_03 34:43

And what about the point about you know, it feels a bit like football managers, do they get enough time to govern?

SPEAKER_00 34:51

Well, the the the fact is, right? We've just had 14 years of austerity. 14 years. The country is destroyed, right? Whether you look at education, whether you look at defense, whether you look at employment rights, whether you look at the workplace, whether you look at the NHS, whether you look at the poor system, all of these have a huge bearing on the cost of living crisis. Yeah, no, it's really, really unfair, but it's a way it is that you would expect the Labour government to come in after 14 years of absolutely destroying the country and all of these things that I've just mentioned, and then expecting the prime minister, and it was Keir Starmer to be able to change things within the first year or so. Um, it is brutal. And if as a prime minister uh like Keith did, he says we'll need 10 years to sort the suit. That's not what people wanted to hear. People that have been suffering for 14 years who wanted who wanted to be able to afford to put food on the table, afford to put the heating on, afford to put the electricity on. Let me just have a little few quain to look after that case. Unfortunately, the Labour Party's under uh care's uh premiership uh understood the difficulties but didn't address them. It didn't deliver, and there's things it could have done in the first six months, but what they did do was withdraw the winter fuel allowance. Uh, and that was like taking money away from pensioners and not sending the wrong message. And from that day, it was uh a downward spiral for the Labour Party. Um, so my answer really is I kind of believe that under the present system there'll ever be a situation where a prime minister can come in after the likes of 14 years and change it in a very short space of time. But you can't change lots of things that put you know what put a smile on people's face, man. Make people feel happy, make people feel valued, welcome people, smile at people, give them some hope, give them opportunities, ambition. That's free. Give them respect, that's free. Didn't do that, I'm afraid.

SPEAKER_03 37:25

Do you do you have someone that you hope goes into that role? I don't know if I'm allowed to ask that or not, but do you have a favorite for that role?

SPEAKER_00 37:34

Well the PM's rule. Um, well, um I'm like um I like a bit. I like a bit. And before before I have a flutter, normally have a look at the runners and the riders. Sure. Look at the form, see what the what the horse or the dog or greyhound might have done in the past. Wear it up so you've got a bit of an idea what to expect and why you think you should be supporting them. And I'll just translate that to uh whoever might put up. It looks like it's gonna be a coronation. Looks like um looks like uh Andy Burnham will be coronated probably as we sit here now. Things could change very quickly. Uh and it looks like um he could be prime minister way before the end of July, you know. But I'm I'll I'll keep me the counsel on it because I think it's important to wait and see who might be putting up, and then you make a decision. Then you're in a you've got a bit of a bargaining tool as well. You can say to them, look, I'll support you if can he give us his guarantee? If can you make sure that you're gonna be looking after the trade unions, if and then I'll then I would make my mind up. But it looks like it's gonna be Andy Burnham, and it looks like he's gonna be the only candidate in it. Now welcome Andy, and I think you'd be you will be a much, much better minister than GSO ever was.

SPEAKER_03 39:07

It's a tough business. Just before I bring our team in from our HQ, what's your hopes for the future for the Labour Party over the the short term? Do you have anything that you're hoping will change?

SPEAKER_00 39:21

Well, you know, the way I've described it, Gul, I've described it to lots of people. There'd be lots of meetings on it, I'm sure you listen. I understand. I've described the situation um as a bit of a life raft. It would be for the party, because I think the party's uh in in you know it's fatally wounded. We've got this life raft, and we can scramble onto the life raft, or we can ground, we can sink. I think we've all agreed that we should be onto this life raft. The life raft should then be onto a safe vessel. So we're all safe and stable, and then that safe vessel should sail away from the rocks and onto dry land, and then we're safe, and we can look to the future and say this is what we need to be doing for a much better society uh than what we've had in the past, but we're just on the life raft at this moment in time, so we've got to, you know, we've got to continue, continue to campaign, continue to fight, uh, and hopefully, because I thought we, you know, and I'm saying we're fairly wounded. I thought it was a possibility of the Labour Party um in the next election, possibly um.

SPEAKER_03 40:49

It's hard to hard to fathom.

SPEAKER_00 40:51

Does that make any sense?

SPEAKER_03 40:52

You know, no one's yeah, no, totally. It's hard to hard to fathom. I'm just going to invite back our headquarters and we've got some quick fire questions for you.

SPEAKER_02 41:04

Probably looking lovely here in the background. You talk about your family and all that thing, all that stuff. So we've got five questions from the team, um, and they're just personal questions, some fun questions. So the first one we have is what is the best career advice you've ever received?

SPEAKER_00 41:23

Career advice ever received was didn't cross a pick a line.

SPEAKER_02 41:28

I got that as well as a kid.

SPEAKER_05 41:32

Um, a question we've got here is what is something that people would be surprised to learn about you.

SPEAKER_00 41:40

Well, that would be telling us lots of things, you know, that I can tell you that anybody else knows. It's a really difficult question now. Um quite often, you know, people people doing a whole yam and what I stand for, uh, haven't got that many you know, seriously. I'm not too sure what people would be surprised to hear. Um he said I'm a big softie. You know, maybe that I'm really the big softie at heart, uh, very uh very compassionate. Uh I love animals, I love um I love wildlife things like that. People live in people live in our side of it. I think I'm sure people are very much aware of it. I love birds. Oh flying type, right? The flying I love birds, uh I love like twitting sort of thing. Um so I think I think that that would be something anyway.

SPEAKER_02 42:44

Oh that's lovely. And the next question we have is what are you listening, watching, or reading right now that you would recommend?

SPEAKER_00 42:54

I'm reading at this moment of time. Um just reading the book, the three revolutions on Cuba, China, and Russia.

SPEAKER_01 43:06

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 43:07

Um, I'm reading that at this moment of time. Um I watching, I like watching documentaries, but I love watching a day relaxed because if I haven't relaxed and watch them and keep your mind occupied, get you know, uh uh settled. So my wife gets mad with this because I've got to like if I'm sitting down, I've got to put some of it on and watch it. So I like I like the documentaries on on Netflix, I like the history, uh the history things, but I also I love comedy. I love comedy, I love laughing, and I love to see people laugh. I used to, I don't know if you've ever been to Blackpool, but there was a a thing at Blackpool at the fair group, and there's this clown and this big like tube thing and you used to put your money in and it just used to laugh. I used to spend all my money just standing there, people. Just start laughing. I love laughing. I love comedy. Um and I like a good like binge on uh Netflix sort of thing. Um does that make any sense? Good choice, a lot of choice, you know. But I I think with regard to reading, being an MP, you've got that much to read. Just to keep up the speed with things. You know, read nine papers every morning. Um, you know, really important that you keep up the speed, and then you've got your political papers, and otherwise newspapers are reading, you know, like and then you've got the you've got your daily stuff and you've got your weekly stuff, and you've got your case work, and you've got all of that, so you do a lot of reading. So um in order to relax, it's not always my favorite thing to sit and read, but I do like TikTok, a little scrolling of TikTok. That's so funny, and too late. You know, you know what, uh now I'm in the room here, but you know what worries me about the likes of TikTok is the algorithms, right? And my expertise on this is absolutely spot-on. I bought a pair of boots on TikTok, safety boots, right? And for the next, and I'll still get it here, for the next six weeks, the algorithm pushed me onto every single different type of safety boot in the world. If anybody needs now, anything about safety boots, um I'm your man. Uh what they can do to your mind and what they can date in young people is so so frightening. Safety boots, I'm your man.

SPEAKER_05 45:51

Um, I've got another question here. Um, what does the perfect fun day to you look like?

SPEAKER_00 45:59

The perfect fun day for me is um watching Newcastle. I love I I love I love match days. I love watching, I love watching sport, I like football, I like cricket, I like horse racing, I like greyhound racing. Um normally you know, I'm a season ticket how I have been for 30 odd years in Newcastle. But you know what I like doing now? I like sitting in the garden, like what I did on on Saturday, it was hot. I'm singed. Um and I I like did a little bit of gardening. I've got a right bacon, and then I sat and I just decided with my wife, she had a glass of wine and I up in the working man's champagne, Stella Artur. Uh, and I just had like a good few cans of freezing cold Stella sitting in the deck chair in my gone, nobody was doing us, um, and just just basically having a probably one too many, or maybe two too many, but I really enjoyed it. But I like to I like to just sit because you know, the family, you know, like being an AMP and being a an active side of my life, you know, my family's got to put up with a lot of you know, like a lot because of me, and it's nice just to sit and relax, particularly, you know, with my wife and have a good crack and few drinks and the world are right.

SPEAKER_02 47:31

Love it. We love that. So the last question we have from the team is what is your biggest source of motivation on hard days?

SPEAKER_00 47:42

Understanding where I come from, understanding the struggles that other people have got, and understanding how lucky I actually am. I've got some money in the bank, you know, I'm 70 and pay. I haven't got any worries about paying me rent. You know, when people say it's a stressful job, tell you what's stressful, not be able to put food on the table for your bands, tell you what's stressful, uh going to the food bunk and having to like open a can of food in the background. Tell you what's stressful. Women in the main single women, uh, for example, who cannot afford to eat themselves, uh, or they cannot afford to eat in both feed the kids and feed themselves, so they're day in without for days on end. That's stressful. Um the motivation for me is understanding how lucky I've been in life. Um, despite all the challenges, understanding that I got like a leg up and uh you know I didn't done all right. And now there's lots of people out there suffering. Uh, and my motivation is that I need to be wherever I can to try and give them the same sort of opportunities I had and look after them wherever I possibly can. And that is a huge motivation. Looking after others, trying to help others, uh, because a lot of people in in a very difficult place, no more time. That makes sense.

SPEAKER_03 49:11

Thank you for saying that. We we agree, we agree with that. Ian, if it's okay, I've got one last question. Who would who would be proud of you and what would they say about your lifetime of achievements from being the president of the National Union of Mine Workers to being an MP and serving your community? Who would who would be proud of you and what would they say about you?

SPEAKER_00 49:36

Well, you know who I'm gonna say.

SPEAKER_03 49:38

Are you gonna say your mum and dad?

SPEAKER_00 49:40

I um I love that they would be terribly proud. Would they terribly proud? Um I absolutely might, you know, the they'll be they would be proud of all Army brothers, regardless, but they'll be extra proud uh if if one of its nothing when we grew up where we grew up through the difficult times and challenges, um, that they would have ever thought that one of the case was gonna be um you know, chairman of the Labour Party, member of Parliament, Chad Cabinet member. Um you know, I've got to say one of the proudest moments of my life wasn't any of them who was becoming a representative at the pit where I worked in a young age, being voted out by the man at the pit to look after them. And I mentioned before with the compensation, very uh difficult, very complex job, very rewarding in many ways, but desperate in others. Uh, that was like probably the the for me the most important job, and the one that I take great pride in. Looking after the people at the pit who had suffered through ill health, through accidents, uh and showing them who had been cared.

SPEAKER_03 50:56

I can't help but think you're right in saying your mum and dad would be proud of you, and your your humanity really shines through. I'm sure the team agree with that. So we're very grateful for you to have joined us on our podcast. Everyone, Ian Levery, MP. Thanks for listening to the Money Made Human podcast. We're grateful to spend time with you and hope you enjoyed it. If you want to join a credit union, choose us with love. Until the next time, first class credit union.